Rubel Shelly Homosexuals and Women in the Temple of God

Everyone prays that EVERYONE be in peace and quietness. Men cannot bring on WRATH or ORGY which includes all of the performing or hypocritic performances: rhetoric, singing, playing, acting.  Women cannot teach OVER men because the authorized pattern is to PREACH the Word by READING the Word and mutually confessing it.  The PURPOSE all inclusives miss and violate is that so that "everyone can be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth." That truth is the elders teaching that which has been taught.

When you tamper with or question the Word of God then you lose any right to see godliness as a means of financial gain. It IS possible that everyone before the latest spawn of theologians were wrong.  However, if you corrupt THE WORD meaning selling any "I thinks" or "in my personal experience" then Paul identifies this as PROSTITUTION.

-WORSHIP ANDROGYNY THE PAGAN SEXUAL IDEAL PETER JONES

Gender Inclusive and Egalitarian Churches of Christ
Gal328 Gender Justice in Church of Christ
        D'Esta Love Pepperdine Board of Directors for Gal328.org
        -Mike Cope Women Worship Leaders

Doug Hurley Your Sons and Daughters shall Prophesy at ACU
See Ken Cukrowski Women in Ministry at ACU
See Ken Cukrowski claiming that the old and new testaments authorizes women prophets.
Jeff Walling Women in Ministry
Mike Cope Women Worship Leaders 

Russ Adcox Women in Ministry
Carroll D. Osburn Women and Change Agenda

Wiley Clarkson one of Ken Cukrowski's disciples
John Mark Hicks Women in the Assembly: Prophesying
Rubel Shelly Homosexuals and Women justice
1. Rubel Shelly Women in God's Service
2. Rubel Shelly: Women in God's Service: Jesus Life and Service
Al Maxey Miriam as Musical Worship Minister

The question for all of us is not what the Bible says, but how and why... Why don't we at least entertain the possibility that the Bible simply reflects an ANCIENT TABOO or homophobic prejudice in a few people like Paul -- a taboo and prejudice we need to outgrow?

If that is POSSIBLE then WE should not pretend to be a Disciple of Christ commanded to teach what He commanded in the Prophets and Apostles. We know from Scripture and history that it was the Scribes and Pharisees or Hypocrites in Ezekiel 33 naming speakers. singers and instrument players for hire. Paul and history calls those who sell their own learning at retail are corrupters of the word meaning prostitutes.

Part Two: Work our your own salvation means work WITH God to find your NEW SCRIPTURE?

Carrol D. Osburn ACU: training Prophets, Channelers and Facilitators: Following Feminist Theology.

Music and Homosexuality go hand in hand.

Rubel Shelly and John York go on to make homosexuality a sin against created order while the role of women is a function of CULTURE, culture changes and therefore we must change. We will show that both are related to nature and homosexuality is a RESULT of men who refuse to have the knowledge of the Word of God in their minds.

The homosexual explanations I have visited make the argument that HOMOSEXUALITY is not wrong because the SCRIPTURES must be read in the context of what God WOULD HAVE said if He had lived in our world. They make a strong effort to make the BIBLE say that its own writers were BRAIN DAMAGED and just reflected their culture.

It is true that Homosexuality and Music were often connected to religious rituals. However, the general practice of homosexuality existed as a spiritual and physical evil before it intruded into most temples including at Jerusalem.

Church: The Spirit's Temple: By: Shelly & York

August 17, 2003

http://rubelshelly.ibelieve.com/content.asp?CID=17733

Church: The Spirit's Temple: By: Shelly & York

Let's begin with the carnal TYPE of the temple of God where NO rhetoricians, sOPHISts, singers or musicians could enter into the Holy Place as a type of the body or church of Christ even to clean out the garbage. Once Christ has been MUSICALLY MOCKED and sacrificed outside the camp, the church is really promised by Jesus to be a SYNAGOGUE which had no singers or musicians or rhetoricians That typifies the Holy Place and the elements of the SEVEN SPIRITS of Christ related to Spiritual knowledge, the table of communion and the incense altar where we enter through Christ and prayer into the Most Holy Place where the ONLY worship takes place in the dark and silent (but for musicians) PLACE of our own spirit as it worships (GIVES HEED) to the Word of God. Jesus said it plainly: if you want to GIVE then let it go from your hand to the hand of the needy. If you pray, then enter into the closet as the dark, quiet and save place much like the Most Holy Place. You cannot ASCEND to God while the Musical Worship team jacks up up into heaven.

The Temple of the Spirit is the PLACE of the human spirit. It dwells in the body only to the extent that Jesus is the ONLY HEAD and ONLY TEACHER through His Words which ARE Spirit and Life.

The ROLE for MALE rhetoricians, sOPHISts, singers, musicians, hypocrites, parasites were done away when Christ died. Why? Because the word PARASITE is derived from the men like the Levites who served the PRIESTS and not God and lived off the hard work of others.

The world is CATCHING ON to the fact that the production of a surplus of Phds has led to the false believe that we MUST HAVE ONE OF THOSE or we will not grow. They have MADE A PLACE for themselves in the MAINSTREAM even when Jesus clearly said that Doctors of the Law "take away the key to knowledge."

Knowing that their time is short and judgment is about to fall, they attempt to make LEGITIMATE their own role by including WOMEN who have always been USED by the clergy in the MANUFACTURE of ritual religion. This is the natural result of women in leadership to utterly destroy the SYNAGOGUE which Jesus promised to build as A SCHOOL OF THE BIBLE and not a pagan WORSHIP CENTER where PARASITES uses the TITHE or LAW OF GIVING to give themselves a living for DESTROYING FAITH.

Rubel Shelly and John York: John: We suggest that the real issue is not, nor has it been in the past, simply a matter of culture leading the church.

Nor is the real issue a matter of some people taking the Bible seriously and others just ignoring Scripture for the sake of contemporary appeal.

Those advocating more active roles for women in the worship assembly take the Bible just as seriously as those who believe women "should be silent in the assembly."

Carrol D. Osburn agrees that the prejudice against Paul MUST extend to Jesus Christ:

> "Jesus did not overthrow hierarchalism" (p. 260).

> "My studies lead me to conclude that there is no biblical mandate for hierarchalism in either the church or society. Hierarchalism is a legacy from remote antiquity, originating in the post-Fall ear of Gen. 3. It was not designed by God, but was the result of human frailty" (p. 260).

> "Paul's arguments carried weight in his day even though they may not necessarily be convincing by today's standards" (p. 135)

That is SITUATIONALLY true because according to Shelly and York:

The question for all of us is not what the Bible says, but how and why.
If what were our only concern,
........... we could read it literally as God's rule book for human behavior
........... apart from any and all cultural contexts.

John Waddey reviewing WOMEN IN THE CHURCH: Reclaiming the Ideal by Carrol D. Osburn of Abilene Christian University (ACU). See total review here.

"Osburn writes, "Much of what is held as 'truth' by patriarchalists seems actually to be nothing more than cultural bias" (p. 43). "In spite of extensive appeal to Scripture, the patriarchal view of women is essential rooted in culture..." (p. 44). In this statement he reveals his attitude toward Scripture. The fact that the Bible says something proves nothing in his mind! Being an academic scholar trumps anything Scripture may say!

Note how Bro. O. views Scripture:

"The Bible is not so much a 'heaven-sent answer book' as a historical book produced within and for a historical community-- yet it serves as Scripture today because people find themselves accountable to it. That is what make its Scripture" (p. 46).

This is one of the most damning statements in his book for it reveals much about his low view of the inspiration of God's Word. God's Word is Scripture whether any man, society or culture understand they are accountable to it. The following quote is no less incriminating.

"...but another step must be taken if the text would actually become Scripture and that is to engage the text in dialogue to ask, 'Now that I understand the meaning of this text for today, can I accept this" (p. 47).

He says,

"Paul's arguments carried weight in his day even though they may not necessarily be convincing by today's standards" (p. 135).

In a foot note on p. 90, Osburn notes "Significant differences exist among evangelical regarding the inspiration, inerrancy, infallibility, and authority of Scripture". It would be enlightening to know just where Bro. Osburn stands on such matters. He quotes David Wright with approval, We must "work out what it means to be faithful at one and the same time both to the doctrinal approach to Scripture as the Word of God and to the historical treatments of Scripture as the words of men" (Emphasis mine, jhw) (p. 108). This helps us understand why he can reach the conclusions he does.

I think it safe to assume that Bro. Osburn grew up in a home, attended a church and a college where folks held what he sneeringly calls the hierarchal or patriarchal view. I suspect he himself held such a view in his early years. Now he has graduated and abandoned his spiritual roots for the view of Pentecostals and liberal Protestants. Still he prefers to stay among us although he sees us as steeped in prejudice, essentially isolationist and culturally biased! This book is a classic demonstration of the new hermeneutic at work. Worldly scholars use this method to convince the weak and untaught that the Bible doesn't mean what it says. The book indicts the author and the school that continues to provide him a forum to spread his anti-scriptural beliefs. JHW

We have reviewed some Carrol D. Osburn quotes here. There is no doubt that the NEW STYLE WORSHIP as a Spectacle is rooted in ancient and modern witchcraft. Therefore, it comes as no surprise that Osburn speaks the agenda of ACU:

Carrol D. Osburn: On pages 14-15: "With so many questions flying around and so much uncertainty being expressed in various quarters, what an opportunity for the various faculties of our Christian colleges and universities to help shape the future! These are the best of times to be involved in Christian education!

If we are to have a truly significant impact upon the national and international scene,

faculties of religion must play leading prophetic roles in channeling and facilitating whatever changes loom ahead.

Carrol D. Osburn makes it clear that HE SPEAKS for ACU as the PRODUCERS of radical, pagan change agents:

Carrol D. Osburn: p. 14-15 An outdated curriculum from a sectarian past that placed emphasis upon transmitting doctrinaire positions will not suffice if we would engage convincingly the larger arenas of current religious thought. É

Our graduate programs must train students how to think, to investigate the biblical text afresh, to feel the pulse of the world around them, to sense where things ought to go, and provide the kind of experiences that will enable servants to go out into churches and communities and provide direction. Hall

We have reviewed father change agent Royce Money who cannot figure out the purpose for the church.

In Discovering our Roots C. Leonard Allen and Richard T. Hughes join the band of The Gang Who Couldn't Shoot Straight. It SEEMS that every quote is taken from a "scholarly book" which is taken from a "scholarly book." When you quote, as we do, men like Martin luther you will discover that they SOMEHOW pervert every quotation. If graded by a TRUE SCHOLAR then the scholarship which has TAKEN CAPTIVE schools like ACU would get a flunking grade: I am embarassed that such ignorance is allowed to fly under the LOGO of "Christian."

If we follow the DIRECT COMMAND and do not engage in sodomy we will not get AIDS and die. Do we have to know WHY? There were always vile diseases connected with homosexuality. It was against nature for the same reason that eating PORK was against nature for primative people.

There is no other way to read it without making Paul a chauvinistic pig who didn't, apparently, understand that there were TWO creation accounts. However, any literate person can see that women were USED by Satan in all of the great FALLS from God'sgrace.

Paul was specificially harsh against homosexuality because among the pagans it had moved from perverted personal practices right into the temples or "churches." It was the PRODUCT of violating the will of God both expressed in nature's CAUSE AND EFFECT but explicitly OUTLAWED by God for ANY SITUATION

All CULTURE was a HOMOSEXUAL CULTURE. Only a small minority in some cultures had to fight for their lives. Therefore, it would be NATURAL for people to accept homosexuality in their kings and priests. It would be COUNTER CULTURAL to warn people against it. Therefore, God had Moses warn the people as they were going into a religiously homosexual culture and because He KNEW that they would not drive them out or kill them.

Sodomites were ready to attack even angels of God. Jesus called the Jews who "speak on their own" the sons of their father the devil. This does not mean that they were part of a Satanic cult. In the same way, the sons of Belial may or may not be part of a cultic practice. We know that singers identified as prostitutes and musicians known as sodomites plagued the area of the Jerusalem temple.

Now as they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain sons of Belial, beset the house round about, and beat at the door, and spake to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thine house, that we may know him. Judges 19:22

That sounds just like the NEW STYLE WORSHIP.

Yatab (h3190) yaw-tab'; a prim. root; to be (causat.) make well, lit. (sound, beautiful) or fig. (happy, successful, right): - be accepted, amend, use aright, benefit, be (make) better, seem best, make cheerful, be comely, / be content, diligent (-ly), dress, earnestly, find favour, give, be glad, do (be, make) good ([-ness]), be (make) merry, please (/ well), shew more [kindess], skilfully, * very small, surely, make sweet, thoroughly, tire, trim, very, be (can, deal, entreat, go, have) well [said, seen].

Baal worship was identified as a MOST PLEASING experience. You see, they wanted a SEEKER CENTER to attract all of the youth! Singing, dancing, clapping, playing instruments with the NEW WINESKIN draped over their naked shoulders INDUCED feelings of sexuality.

And the man, the master of the house, went out unto them, and said unto them, Nay, my brethren, nay, I pray you, do not so wickedly; seeing that this man is come into mine house, do not this folly. Judges 19:23

Behold, here is my daughter a maiden, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not so vile a thing. Judges 19:24

Rape was just as UNNATURAL as sodomy. Therefore, Lot did not say that the were violating the creative pattern but they were WICKED.

The worst form of homosexuality and the MOST LIKELY place to induce such feelings by being attractive to talented, musical "prophets" was in connection with religion. That did not make private homosexuality RIGHT but the PRACTICE is most often stimulated by EXCITING religious ceremonies which violate what Jesus would do and Paul directly commanded in Romans 15.

Sodomy was not NATURAL: it was obviously a vile, disgusting act in the PRIVATE WORLD.

Those who tried "to be all things to all people" knew that homosexuals in the priesthood would ATTRACT the SEEKERS of things like music which arouses unnatural impulses of "fight, flight or sexuality." Sure, CULTURE demanded that some "prophet" make homosexuality OK in the pagan temples:

Talmud, Tractate Sanhedrin

"54a-54b), although opinions varied whether it was punishable by death. Deuteronomy 23:17-18 must be read in conjunction with 1 Kings 14:24; 15:12; 22:46, and 2 Kings 23:7, all of which allude to the presence of cultic prostitution, including male prostitution, in Jerusalem in the ninth, eighth, and seventh centuries B.C. These texts, along with 1 Kings 15:13, suggest that the queen mother maintained a fertility cult to the goddess Asherah in the Jerusalem temple (see S. Ackerman, "The Queen Mother and the Cult of Ancient Israel,"

This practice grew into, not only forms of pagan worship, but also a means of supplying money for the temple. Catamites, boys and men who were exclusively used for passive anal sex, began to serve the temples.

One must wonder whether boys were sometimes forced into this kind of sexual contact due to economic circumstances, much like their female counterparts. Women often survived only by prostitution since they were allowed no inheritance.

Orphan boys may often have found themselves in the same predicament. Regardless, it was very early in human history that both male and female prostitutes were used in temple worship in order to raise funds for the temple, as well as support themselves."

The USE of professional musicians is DE FACTO the use of sexually talented people in the "idolatry of talent." I has NEVER had any higher motive than to RAISE FUNDS for paganistic religious institutions whose "ceremonies" fail to bring in enough to pay the illegial STAFF INFECTION. Paul's prohibition of NON-SEDENTARY WOMEN and therefore also of effemate males is that the AUTHORITY is the Greek AUTHENTIA which is both "erotic and murderous" but COST EFFECTIVE.

PRIESTHOODS have always been loaded with homosexuals. The Navigators survey shows that 85% of those in the pulpits are FEMALE ORIENTED while 85% of those in the pews are masculine or WORD oriented. That is why the WORD is out and VISIONARY QUESTS and IMAGES and MUSIC is end. See Malchion.

The ancient contemporaneous literature treats the SIN against Adam as SODOMY. Rember that it was as Lucifer, the harp playing prostitute, who was primarily ZOE (often EVE) and female but able to CHANGE with the situation to sodomize Adam. If Paul is correct that Eve was "wholly seduced" as a virgin is seduced prior to her wedding then Lucifer got the first shot so that Cain (a musical note) and Abel were only maternal twins. The same documents warn that Satan would try to SODOMIZE Jesus as the way to totally disqualify Him. The PIPING hoping that Jesus and others would do the Dionysus song and dance prove that the CLERGY was trying to INITIATE Jesus to prove that He was their anticipated Messiah, Dionysus who had figured in the Abomination of Desolation and who still controlled the, always homosexual, priesthood.

If God says, loud and clear, that SODOMY is both destructive (sexual diseases or plagues were always common among priesthoods) and is CONTRARY to the Will of God. We LISTEN to what the Bible says because we don't ALL want to discover the laws of gravity by jumping off tall buildings. God's laws are not to RESTRICT you but to PROTECT YOU.

If you are not AWAKE, Rubel Shelly and John York do the USUAL association between recognized evil and culture. For instance, Rubel Shelly uses terms like FRATRICIDE or "brother killers" to define those teaching against the MUSICAL SECTARIANS. It is pretence to ignore the fact that those known as "the church of Christ" down through history had always rejected INSTRUMENTAL MUSIC EN TOTO as the product of the ETERNAL FEMALE MIND making SPACE for both homosexuality and music in the MAINSTREAM.

We know, for instance, that ALL pagan gods or goddesses were homosexual. They DEMANDED a homosexual and emasculated priesthood. Modern PREACHERHOOD as a CRAFT (A. Campbell) has been shown by the Navigators to be 85% female driven while 85% of their AUDIENCE TAKEN CAPTIVE are masculine or mental (spiritual) driven. The perfect test is between those who are WORD directed and those who are RITUAL directed. All musical rituals were once the EXCLUSIVE domain of children, women or homosexual males.

It ignores facts that the CULTURE of the GREEKS to whom Paul wrote was TOLERANT of homosexuality which pervaded their philosophers, singers, instrmentalists, emperors and kings.

Therefore, we trust Paul to have been led by the SPIRIT Who said "I am Jesus of Nazareth."

The Abomination of Desolation in the Temple's holy precincts and the GYMNASIUM and the Temple to PHALLUS still permeated the Jewish priesthood. The PIPING trying to get others including Jesus to SING and DANCE the Dionysus CHORAL was, among the MUSICIANS, an effort to INITIATE Jesus as Dionysus.

Because Paul was not IGNORANT he knew the connection between the UNCOVERED prophesying of the women who endangered the SYNAGOGUE OF CHRIST at Corinth. He knew the eternal connection between drunken rhetoricians, singers and instrumentalists meant a HOMOSEXUAL attempt to pervert those devoted to the WORD just as throughout the Bible

The Dionysus or Bacchus Musical Worship Team also carried the WINESKIN draped over their drunken shoulder. The harp is the BARBATON which identified the "speakers with drunken tongues" as BARBARIANS. The JUDAS BAG "for carrying the mouthpieces of wind instruments" is always shown attached the FLUTE CASE. And don't remember that the TRIUMPH OVER of Judas in Psalm 41 means to "play instruments and 'make a joyful noise before the Lord.'" Why was this outlawed for the synagogue (Num 10:7)? Because it was the war chant to destroy the courage and MANLINESS of the enemy.

The are no ISTS in the Bible as in PsalmISTS or flutISTS or harpISTS because they were PARASITES.

psalmôid-ia , singing to the harp

Word with similar definition

barbit-ôidos , on, singing to the barbiton, (pictured above worshiping the god of the NEW WINESKIN)

kômôido-loicheô , play the parasite

Similar meaning

kômôidoloicheô 1 [leichô] to play the parasite and buffoon,

Lur-ôideô , play the lyre,
pithêk-izô , play the ape, of flatterers,: barbarous form epitêkizi or epitêkize

hupopi thêkizô , play the ape a little, hupo ti mikron epithêkisa Ar.V. 1290; cf. pithêkizô.

mikros

I. small, little, in point of Size, Hom., etc.; also in point of Quantity, Hes., Ar., etc.

2. in Amount or Importance, little, petty, trivial, slight, Theogn., Soph., etc.; sm. tithêsi me makes me of small account. Soph.; ou smikron phronei id=Soph.

Similar Definition

cithari-zo , a-re, v n., = kitharizô, to play on or strike the cithara, Nep. Epam. 2, 1; Vulg. Apoc. 14, 2.

Similar Definition

parasi-tor . a-ri, v. dep. [id.] , to play the parasite, to sponge: parasitarier, Plaut. Stich. 4, 2, 54 : parasitando pascere ventres suos, id. Pers. 1, 2, 3 .

Psalm 22 and Psalm 41 prophesied that under the lead of Judas the clergy would attempt to MUSICALLY MOCK Jesus right to the Cross.

All they that see me laugh (h3932 = "speak in tongues") me to scorn: they (hurl insults) shoot out the lip, they shake the head, saying, Psalm 22:7

Leag (h3932) law-ag'; a prim. root; to deride; by impl. (as if imitating a foreigner) to speak unintelligibly: - have in derision, laugh (to scorn), mock (on), stammering.

Laeg (h3934) law-ayg'; from 3932; a buffoon; also a foreigner: - mocker, stammering.

From men like Heredotus and others we know that the Jewish CLERGY anticipated that their MESSIAH would be Dionysus. When Jesus refused to participate they knew that he would destroy their entire CHURCH STRUCTURE of "rhetoricians, sophists, singers, musicians, sorcerers, hypocrites, parasites." The SECT of the Hypocrites filled these roles and in the book of Revelation they are the craftsmen (techne), singers and instrumentalists UNDER the holy whore. John knew her as CIRCE burried in his view on Patmos. She gave her name to CHURCH and she imposed her MINISTERS on the world. They were the SORCERERS and in the Greek world, since they DID NOTHING for the PAY, they were known as PARASITES.

Aristophanes, Plutus

Cario

I will copy that Circe of Corinth, whose potent philtres compelled the companions of Philonides like swine to swallow balls of dung, which she herself had kneaded with her hands; and do you too grunt with joy and follow your mother, my little pigs.

Jesus cast the musical minstrels out LIKE DUNG. Therefore, when SYNAGOGUE OF CHRIST turns back to CHURCH or CIRCE, don't be surprised that the rhetoricians as PARASITES want to feed you with BALLS OF DUNG. The Flute-girls as prostitutes in Athens were under the control of the officials who controlled how DUNG was cast out of the city and bodies were buried.

The Israelites worshipped Baal-Peor by EATING the sacrifices made to him. These sacrifices consisted of "worshipers" deficating on him and even rubbing it on his nose. The Israelites, totally given over to worship THE STARRY HOSTS with music, just came along and ATE the sacrifices.

When people are TOTALLY TAKEN CAPTIVE they often eat their own children and fight over dung. The Cane Ridge "awakening" was much like that as the grunted and barked like dogs and fought over the garbage.

Kirke Circe, an enchantress, dwelling in the island Aea, who changed Ulysses' companions into swine

Word which appears with Kirke

hetaira

1. a companion, Il.; phorminx, hên daiti theoi poiêsan hetairên Od.; penia sphin hetaira Theocr.

2. opp. to a lawful wife, a concubine, a courtesan, Hdt., attic

2. courtesan, Hdt.2.134, Ar.Pl.149, Ath.13.567a,571d, etc.; opp. pornê (a common prostitute), Anaxil.22.1 ; opp. gametê, Philetaer.5 ; Aphroditê he. Apollod.Hist.17.

A word which appears with the courtesan

phorminx the phorminx, a kind of lyre or harp, the oldest stringed instrument of the Greeks, esp. as the instrument of Apollo, Hom.; with seven strings (after Terpander's time), Pind. [Commonly referred to pherô, as if it were the portable lyre: better perh. from Root .phrem, Lat. fremo, to sound.]

Apollo is Abbadon or Apollyon of the book of Revelation. He "navigated the winds of change" to INFILTRATE (as an angel or dolphin or light) ministers to SERVE at his ORACLE with music. As pay they were given a KNIFE and could take as many LAMBS as they needed from the CONTRIBUTIONS given in return for lies.

Apollo unleases the LOCUSTS who were sent into sheol because as MUSES they offended the Mother of the Gods. In the end-times they are resurrected as "musical performers" to MARK and PUNISH those marked by music and SEND AWAY those who still have the MARK of the word on them. We can watch it happening.

Circe, Kirke or church used music and enchantement to sexually trap men. Then, she turned them into BEASTS and fed them with DUNG cakes. The singing of the Musical Worship Team (women) was the same CLANGING Paul warned about. Jesus cast them out LIKE DUNG because they were PAGANS and often male and female prostitutes.

> klang-ê , hê, metapl. dat. klangi Ibyc.56 : ( [klazô] ):--any sharp sound, e.g. twang of the bow, Il.1.49; scream of birds, esp. cranes,

to which are compared confused cries of a throng, 3.3, Od.11.605, cf. Il.2.100, 10.523;

grunting of swine,

howling of wolves and lions,

hissing of serpents,

baying of dogs, X.Cyn.4.5, etc.;

also, of musical instruments, of Cassandra's prophecies

of the scream of the Harpies, A.R.2.269. Perseus

 

> klangê (klazô): scream, properly of birds, Od. 11.605; of animals,

as the squealing of pigs, Od. 14.412;

and of the loud cry of warriors, Il. 2.100;

the sharp twang of a bowstring, Il. 1.49. Perseus

> klazô

1. to make a sharp piercing sound, of birds, to scream, screech, Il., Soph., etc.; of dogs, to bark, bay, Od., Ar.; of things, as of arrows in the quiver, to clash, rattle, Il.; of the wind, to whistle, Od.; of wheels, to creak, Aesch.; c. acc. cogn., klazousi phobon ring forth terror, id=Aesch.

2. of men, to shout, scream, Il.:--the nearest approach to articulate sound is in Aesch., mantis eklanxen allo mêchar shrieked forth another remedy; Zêna epinikia klazôn sounding loudly the victory-song of Zeus, id=Aesch. Henry George Liddell, Robert Scott, An Intermediate Greek-English Lexicon

The craftsmen (techne) in Revelation 18 were FACILITATORS of the singers and musicians. They were also the rhetoricians or sOPHISts or WORD MERCHANTS. They belonged to the SECT of the hypocrites and were known as PARASITES.

Rubel Shelly and John York: Rubel: Let me give you an example to work with in relation to the question you've raised: homosexuality and the ordination of practicing homosexuals to ministry.

Why don't we at least entertain the possibility that the Bible simply reflects an ANCIENT TABOO or homophobic prejudice in a few people like Paul -- a taboo and prejudice we need to outgrow?

Is that a question or a suggestion?

Shelly and York will attempt to put homosexuality in a separate class: it is wrong not because it is anti-Biblical but it violates nature. But, why should we OFFER as a POSSIBLE reason for the Bible's APPARENT condemnation Paul's homophobic prejudice?

If Rubel is correct and homosexuality is just AGAINST THE CREATED ORDER then this DOES strongly question Paul who said that it was the PRODUCT of what we see in the NEW STYLE WORSHIP. Paul said that the LAW restricts women: Rubel says that CULTURE restricts women.

Because they identify the role of women as a CULTURAL problem then we cannot be sure whether they actually believe the homophobic POSSIBILITY. I just don't believe that it is wise to CONSIDER THE POSSIBILITY that Paul was homophobic as Postmodernism declares that men like Paul and John were not really REMEMBEING the old events and were therefore not inspired. They in fact were following THEIR OWN AGENDA? That denies that the epistles were inspired.

If we question Paul's motivation, then why would Paul bury murder and God-hating in a list which puts homosexuality at the top of the list in showing that it is the RESULT of a murderous and God-hating spirit because it hated His Word?

Certainly murder is against nature: if I kill you then you may kill me. But, murder which is grouped

Was Paul mistaken? Is murder and God-hating acceptable? Can we entertain the POSSIBILITY? No. We need to see that to the literate world it has SEEMED that God actually articulated a law against it.

Paul said that in the GOSPEL a righteousness is revealed and that the JUST shall live by faith. Isn't it possible that preaching the gospel warned people of specific forms of SIN? The problem is that the GODHEAD is not revealed by nature. God HAT SHEWED it to them. If early scholars are correct then SODOMY was one of the first sins.

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Romans 1:21

NATURE has led most people to idolatry and even polytheism as in the Babylonian Triad. Therefore, "nature" also speaks of "by natural descent." The first parents TOLD the next generaton what they knew from walking with God.

Paul may have been Old Testament Literate:

And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the Lord. Lev 18:21

Was the WHY of God's direct command, the often connection with burning babies to the beat of instrumental music in the worship of Molech?

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination. Lev 18:22

God said that it was an abomination? Do we have to know WHY it got in Moses' old writings? An abomination means DISGUSTING. Surely, sodomites could determine that sodomy was disgusting. Therefore, it was against nature but it was also against God's Commandment which seems to validate "necessary inferences." I can infer that smoking is an abomination just by smoking one.

Neither shalt thou lie with any beast to defile thyself therewith: neither shall any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto: it is confusion. Lev 18:23

Defile not ye yourselves in any of these things: for in all these the nations are defiled which I cast out before you: Lev 18:24

And the land is defiled: therefore I do visit the iniquity thereof upon it, and the land itself vomiteth out her inhabitants. Lev 18:25

An abomination is not just ANTI-NATURE:

Towebah (h8441) to-ay-baw'; or toebah to-ay-baw'; fem. act. part. of 8581; prop. something disgusting (mor.), i. e. (as noun) an abhorrence; espec. idolatry or (concr.) an idol: - abominable (custom, thing), abomination

God said that IDOLATRY is contrary to nature: can't we grasp that using half a tree to build a fire and the other half to WORSHIP dishonores God? If this is just contrary to nature and the role of WOMEN was just a cultural thing, then why does God not select women for priestly roles?

Homosexuality was also a part of fertility religion. For instance, it has been noted that Jezebel used homosexuality to bind the flesh and spirit together. Homosexuality and music were often seen as able to move the worshipers into the presence of God. Therefore, Moses says that it is a disgusting form of idolatry. Perhaps much like EATING THE SACRIFICES made to Baal-Peor. People worshipped him by deficating in his presence and even wiping on his nose. This is the meaning of sodomy which was not JUST TOLERATED because we include everyone: it was a vital part of creating an anti- god religion.

Greenberg points out Hittite, Babylonian and Assyrian texts which refer to these male prostitutes. The texts picture assinu and kurgarru as

"religious functionaries particularly associated with the goddess Ishtar,
who danced, played musical instruments, wore masks,
and were considered effeminate....
such functionaries were believed to have magical powers...
........... 'if a man touches the head of an assinu, he will conquer his enemy'...
........... 'if a man has intercourse with an assinu, trouble will leave him.'"

Greenberg, David F. The Construction of Homosexuality . The University of Chicago Press, 1988. Quoted by Arlene Robbins

Being AGAINST NATURE did not give Miriam the right to be a REVEALING prophetess.

Therefore, the VILEST effect of homosexuality was tolerating it and making it seem essential to the actual worship of God.

The most common form among the Greek officials and clergy including Catholic priests was pederasty: the love of a man for a young boy. When clergy get caught it is especially damaging. When homosexuals become CLERGY you can bet that it will rapidly become a METROPOLITAN church overrun by active and deactive homosexuals.

Why should the church risk its witness as a SCHOOL OF CHRIST by insisting that homosexuals can have a role among the other unlawful clergy?

If homosexuality is a mind set then does this mean that we might ORDAIN "spiritual homosexuals" who have given up the practice? The bait and switch is that the Bible doesn't authorize even unbelievers of the WORD to be ordained for the pulpit. In fact, if Jesus fired the Doctors of the Law because they "take away the key to knowledge" should ANYONE fill the pulpit in the church which was the SYNAGOGUE of CHRIST? There is no role for even children to "sing" other than as one reads the Hallel. Among the Jewish clergy there was no role for "allegorizing" or Narrative Theology or "taking liberties" with the Words of God in Christ. When sOPHISts discovered the young church Peter warned that because it is the Word of God, delivered with supernaturral signs and then written to the world it was NOT LEGAL to "Privately Interpret." This means further expound. Therefore, no STRAIGHT guy can function as a sOPHISt which means filling the role of the OPHIS or serpent.. Slick and cunning (naked) expounders began with Satan as the Musical Enchanter in the garden of Eden.

He asked "Hath God really said?" What we understand is that by QUESTIONING the OPHIS is so attractive and repulsive at the time that he could TELL you a question. The lie was God hath not said. That is to Hegel.

In the Greek world rhetoricians, sOPHISts, singers, musicians and craftsmen (techne in Rev 18) worked as SORCERERS. They belonged to the SECT of the Hypocrites and were therefore PARASITES. sOPHISts became VILE specificially they violated the rule that the TEACHER was a MINISTER and not a PARASITE. When they charged to teach you the art of "getting along" they grew to be despised. Because the WORD of God is free of charge (Isa 55) Ezekiel castigated the female false prophetess (preacher) because she had AUTHENTIA authority--erotic and murderous. She could use her false prophesying (singing) and seductive dress to MAKE SOULS FLY to steal them.

Because, consistent with Shelly's CORE GOSPEL to Say the queston "was Paul homophobic" would mean that the epistles are the divisive writings of divided APOSTLES. That would mean that men like Paul simply used "philosophy and their OWN personal agenda to write their message." We know that the BAND has ceased preaching the epistles and have declared for the CORE GOSPEL ONLY.

That would mean that Paul was NOT inspired and that he was not under the guidance of the HOLY SPIRIT Who said that He was "Jesus of Nazareth." That would mean that PAUL is wrong because true scholarship is aware, as any reader can be aware, that Paul NEVER identifies the spirit as THE holy spirit as a GA, Boles, Lucado, Shelly THIRD MEMBER OF THE FAMILY OF GODS--Tritheism or polytheism.

Why would such a questioner of Christ and the eyewitness Apostles who CLAIMED to have the Spirit of Christ guiding them into all truty "TAKE PAY for whittling away on the FAITH" of those who pay the Billl.

Is that a DOUBLE CROSS?

That would mean that the BIBLE IS NOT INSPIRED. That would mean that anyone who is a rhetorician or sOPHISts for pay is known by the Greek world as a HYPOCRITE. The OPHIS was the "serpent" in the book of Revelation as the "serpent" in the garden is defined by the Hebrew world and the contemporaneous literature and religion as a MUSICAH ENCHANTER. The serpent is used because he enCHANTS us. We see him as a totally disgusting fellow but we CANNOT take our eyes off him. The serpent is known as the BRASS TRUMPET which is like the COBRA. We cannot take our eyes off the SNAKE while he entertains us. But, whoa! He thin SPIRT in our eye and BLINDS US: the rhetorician, sophist, singer and musician LEADS US INTO EVIL and was condemned because they are ALL PARASITES.

Rubel Shelly and John York: Rubel: Homosexuality is wrong because it negates the creative design of human sexuality. It seeks to satisfy the innate desire for bonding within love through a means other than the one God established in the created order.

Thus homosexuality is wrong
........... not because it violates a command
........... but because it violates the divine will as expressed in creation itself.

It is the unholy violation of the created order that generates the biblical prohibitions.

They are universal and transcultural, not rooted in a particular time, place, or prejudice. They are rooted in the narrative of God's nature and activity as related in Scripture, and they cannot be abandoned without giving up the notion that Scripture is authoritative for Christianity.

This can be TRUE only if the Bible is REPUDIATED. Paul referred to religious practices which gave the "civilians" permission to practice Sodomy along with other sins. For instance the Abomination of Desolation in the temple in Jerusalem was the worship of Zeus and Dionysus. This so perverted the clergy and civilians in Jerusalem that Jesus refused to even reveal the gospel to them.

Arnobius identifies another "mark" of the beast and refutes Robbin's claim:

Moreover, not content to have ascribed to the gods love of women, do you also say that they lusted after men? Some one loves Hylas; another is engaged with Hyacinthus; that one burns with desire for Pelops; this one sighs more ardently for Chrysippus;

"Catamitus is carried off to be a favourite and cup-bearer; and Fabius, that he may be called Jove's darling, is branded on the soft parts, and marked in the hinder.

Ganymede: 

"Upon hearing that Ganymede was to be cup bearer as well as Zeus' lover, the infinitely jealous Hera was outraged.

Therefor Zeus set Ganymede's image among the stars as the constellation Aquarius, the water carrier. Aquarius was originally the Egyptian god over the Nile. The Egyptian god poured water not wine from a flagon.

Remember that Stephen says that God "turned them over to worship the starry host" as a result of their musical idolatry at Mount Sinai which included perversion. Watch out for people who see this as an example for Christian worship and community and speak of baptizing the S.U.N. God to think about the S.O.N. god:

"All of Zeus' scandalous liaisons have allegorical meanings. Zeus' torrid affair with Ganymede was a religious justification for homosexuality within the Greek culture.

Before the popularity of the Zeus and Ganymede myth spread,

the only toleration for sodomy was an external form of goddess worship. Cybele's male devotees tried to achieve unity with her by castrating themselves and dressing like women.

"While Platonic love needed women for regeneration purposes (grow the attendance)

the philosopher used this myth to justify his sexual feelings towards his all male pupils.

The first women in the world proved that it was AGAINST NATURE for her, as the junior of the pair, to take the lead and INSTRUCT ADAM. If the testimony according to contemperaneous documents is correct then when Lucifer "changed herself" and Adam ate the fruit it was sodomy and DISGUSGING.

But is violating the WILL OF GOD in nature WORSE than VIOLATING A COMMAND. If one violates a command by selling the Word and one takes pay for selling his body, does either qualify for ministry.

Doesn't Paul grasp that there is a CREATIVE difference between males and females? Doesn't he know that there IS a command to be violated.

The "hath God said" set up is that WOMEN IN MINISTRY is not against nature. Therefore, Paul was just echoing CULTURE when he PROHIBITED women from any non-silent, non-sedentray roles. By setting Paul aside we can do what Satan did when he set God's word aside. Then, we can be the latter day authority to COUNTERMAND Paul and finally catch up to the CULTURE. You understand, this is just a conservative church of Christ or the "non-instrumental" church of Christ. The PCA which is fueling Smith Springs are having their own troubles with women in ministry.

But, once we have set Paul aside by questioning his cultural biase against the public USE of women, how can we resist the Gay's declaration that Paul's wasn't really AGAINST homosexuality in any sense other than as RITUAL PROSTITUTION in the places of WORSHIP. They deny that the SODOMITES were just common, acceptable sodomites but they were CULTIC prostitutes.

The Scripture is allowed to be AUTHORITATIVE for Christianity ONLY to the extent it is not the CARRIERS of things we would like to change: to make homosexuality a sin against NATURE

and therefore make WOMEN able to STAND OVER or become non-silent or non-sedentary

because there is no NATURAL prohibition and because Paul was a male chauvinist victim of his culture.

But this PREJUDICES the audience in favor of non-practicing homosexuals and women in active roles because it REPUDIATES the very words where Paul declared that because some things are UNNATURAL they are made into Commandments.

Should women be flattered that such an effort is made to pry WOMEN loose from deactive HOMOSEXUALS?

If something GROWS to be NATURAL then there is no command even SEEN in Paul's epistles .

Therefore, "conservatives" (that Raca word) simply have not GROWN to the point of FELLOWSHIPING homosexuals just because the are not COMFORTABLE with their sin.

For those who are not postmodern, post-Biblical, everyone knew that Shelly and York are wrong and that Scripture does not approve of a NON PRACTICING HOMOSEXUAL in the pulpit. If a bank robber is not presently PRACTICING bank robbing then it is OK for him to fill the pulpit even though we know that his NATURE is going to PERVERT the Word into making his sin JUST NATURAL.

Here what Paul says of the Pre flood, post flood and the MOUNT SINAI MUSICAL IDOLATRY

Here is Paul's version which appears in 3 dozen documents showing that lucifer (Zoe) taught the YOUTH especially WOMEN how to use singing, playing instrument s and using cunning speech to lead the Holy Sethites out of the presence of the LIVING WORD anddown into the dark valley of Cain (a musical note). The goal was to lead them into HOMOSEXUALITY even between father and son. Once they FELL they could NEVER GET UP. It was the MUSICAL ENCHANTING (the Serpent image) which caused them to FALL. Women were the ONLY thing which could have made possible Lucifers (the harp- playing prostitute) TRAFFICK or commerce--even stealing the souls of men.

How, then could Paul be a CULTURAL FREAK when he knew the DIFFERENCE between BODY WORSHIP and the idolatry of the IMAGE OF A MAN and spiritual (mental) devotion to the Word. Worship in both the old and New Testaments boils down to GIVING HEED TO GOD and GIVING HEED TO God Whose name is Jesus or Jehovah- Saves.

IF you pay, for instance, $90,000.oo for a Musical Worship Minister to, in Shelly's words, "Lead you into the presence of God" you are SUBSTITUTING the Levitical "sounders" who could never, on the penalty of death, enter into the Holy Place as a type of the body or church of Christ.

Because preachers of UNTRUTH are a sOPHISts, when you GIVE HEED to him you are expected to believe that HE is the agent of God. You are worshiping the PERFORMERS when you GIVE HEED to the singing of erotic songs often teaching error and ALWAYS teaching effeminancy and PIPING DOWN the WORDS of Jesus Christ. He said MY WORDS are SPIRIT and LIFE.

This is the IDOLATRY OF TALENT. And in ALL of history when the EFFEMINATE (women and children) rule over you the NATURAL OUTCOME or work product is HOMOSEXUALITY. Our Paul says that homosexuality is the PRODUCT of certain forms of ancient pagan religions.

For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. Rom 1:17

Putting a reformed homosexual in the pulpit is going to say that they can retrieve themselves. Unfortunately, all of the recorded examples refute this because HOMOSEXUALITY is the dead end. Their past would always put up a barrier and restrict them from being VISIBLE IMAGES of God.

Therefore, no Bible literate person is going to ask about PRACTICING homosexuals in the ministry. It is against nature, disgusting and AGAINST THE EXPLICIT LAW.

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Rom 1: 18

God's wrath in Hebrew means to make people into buffoons. Paul's Greek word is:

Orge (g3709) or-gay'; from 3713; prop. desire (as a reaching forth or excitement of the mind), i.e. (by anal) violent passion (ire, or [justifiable] abhorence); by impl. punishment: - anger, indignation, vengeance, wrath.

Oregomai (g3713) or-eg'-om-ahee' mid. of appar. a prol. form of an obsol. prim. [comp. 3735]; to stretch oneself, i.e. reach out after (long for): - covet after, desire.

3735 is the OROS or mountain

This the battle between the Word of Christ and those trying to lift themselves up to be BIG MOUNTAINS. Jesus died to remove the burden laded by the clergy: it means "spiritual anxiety created by religious ceremonial." Romans 15 defines the "synagogue" as the way to solve the problems in Romans 14. Imitating Jesus Christ Paul said that we should not PLEASE ourselves. This means to create SPIRITUAL EXCITEMENT. This is the proof that GOD is pouring out His wrath.

When God POURS OUT HIS WRATH of the cup from the NEW WINSKIN he sends STRONG DELUDERS who make buffoons of YOU and of THEMSELVES. Paul said in his second letter to Corinth, in effect, that FOOLS LOVE TO BE FOOLS:

hupo-kritikos , ê, on, belonging to hupokrisis 11 , skilled therein, esti phuseôs to hu. einai having a good delivery,

2. suited for speaking or delivery, (sc. technê) the art of delivery, (but, the actor's art, .
3. metaph., acting a part, pretending to

If a person has a GOOD DELIVERY or "singing" voice shall we let them stand in the holy place because they are NOT JUST NOW the CRAFTSMEN or TECHNE who will go back into hell along with the holy whore, her singers, musicians and GRINDERS (concubines or prostitute)?

hupokrinomai

I. to reply, make answer, answer, Hom., Hdt.
2. to expound, interpret, explain, Od., Ar.:--the attic word in this sense is apo-krinomai.
II. of actors, to answer on the stage: hence to play a part, be an actor
2. to represent dramatically: hence to exaggerate
3. metaph. to play a part, to feign, pretend, c. inf., id=Dem.

When Jesus rejected the Pharisees He rejected the SECT of the Scribe (book writer) and the SECT of the Hypocrites. One who FURTHER EXPOUNDS or acts or sings in response is a HYPOCRITE and therefore like a GUITARIST is a PARASITE.

Peter says that because Scripture was spoken by Christ, validated by supernatural signs and written for MEMORY by eyewitnesses that SCRIPTURE is not subject to private interpretation. This means FURTHER EXPOUNDING. If you TAKE PAY to tell people that Paul was a cultural deviant for his UNIVERSAL repudiation of homosexuals or performing people, then you violate a DIRECT COMMAND of Peter and DENY that even Jesus was as competent as latter day prophets.

To reject the Word is the unforgivable sin which leads to God pouring out hia wrath by making the hypocrites into Jesters and Buffoons.

Of those who would DIVERT a non-instrumental church into being an instrumental church and taking pay for it as rhetorician or Sophist, the Greek had a word for it.

A similar Latin word is:

Parasi-tus , i, m., = parasitos, lit. one who eats with another; hence,

I. In gen., a guest (pure Lat. conviva): parasiti Jovis, the gods, Varr. ap. Aug. Civ. Dei, 6, 7; App. M. 10, p. 246, 35.--Hence, parasitus Phoebi, a player, actor, Mart. 9, 29, 9.--

II. In partic., in a bad sense, one who, by flattery and buffoonery, manages to live at another's expense, a sponger, toad-eater, parasite

The NARRATIVE THEOLOGY of Rubel Shelly and John York is acting as an ACTOR to present the TRUTH which has been lost to the world who thought that the WORD was free of charge (Isa 55).

Therefore, narrative actors are BUFFOONS and therefore PARASITES. The Greek world identifies these as the SORCERIERS or POISONERS in the book of Revelation.

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. Rom 1: 19

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Rom 1: 20

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Rom 1: 21

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, Rom 1: 22

And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Rom 1: 23

The most common IDOL was the Asherah pole: a free standing, non-functioning pillar. These were worshipped by the men at the temple when they bowed to the east. The women were lamenting or making music to Tammuz trying to resurrect him to play the flute with them.

Old, Old woodcut of Jerusalem

The Greek world were told that rhetoricians, sophists, singers and musicians were either GODS or the SPOKESMEN for the Gods.

Barnabas they called Zeus, and Paul they called Hermes because he was the chief speaker. Ac.14:12

The priest of Zeus, whose temple was just outside the city, brought bulls and wreaths to the city gates because he and the crowd wanted to offer sacrifices to them. Ac.14:13

The subject may be Zeus pursuing Ganymede... The boy on the reverse carries a lyre (more often associated with Tithonos in his flight from Eos). Zeus is said to have carried off Ganymede, prince of Troy, to be his cup-bearer, later his bedfellow ("catamite" derives from "Ganymede" through the Latin). It is also said that Ganymede was first abducted by Eos, the Dawn, who was in the habit of such carryings-on -- and off. Pursuit scenes, Zeus after Ganymede, Eos after Tithonos or Kephalos, Boreas after Oreithyia, satyr after maenad (see Chicago 1905.345),

This is why Zeus- Dionysus worship in the Jerusalem Temple was the Abomination which brings desolation. The end times will repeat this with musicians or sorcerers or parasites (Reve 18). You have to worry about the new graduates who are emphatic is honor je ZEUS.

The worship of Zeus and Dionysus in the Jerusalem Temple involved homosexuals and music which ATTACHED TO HOMOSEXUALS. Rubel Shelly claims that John got his idea of the LOGOS from the Greeks. We have shown that LOGOS is simply a translation of the Hebrew DABAR who appears as God's Word personified in Genesis. Losos was Hermes and is worshipped as THE MESSENGER OF THE GODS. He has winged shoes, like NIKE, and is THE SOURCE OF TRUTH.

See Second Maccabees

The UNIVERSAL RESULT of abandoning the word and WORSHIPING the idolatry of men is the FRUIT of their on false teaching and PRACTICES especially adopting MUSIC and the authority of women. The word Paul used was AUTHENTIA which is both EROTIC and MURDEROUS. No woman can take the OVERSIGHT or PRESIDE OVER without exercising SEXUAL AUTHORITY.

Here is what you PREDESTINATEDLY GET when you begin to WORSHIP males of attractive appearance and ENCHANTING musical skils. The Greek "sing" was for the lower, masculine speaking voice. That is why Paul's ONLY command was to SPEAK the revealed word one to another. The falsetto male voice in the higher register we are told would be suitable for the pagan temple (brothel) but to the rational Greek it would soundl more like CRYING OUT (Jesus wouldn't do that) or screeching or screaming. It sounds that way to many modern ears.

"THERE IS NOT OTHER TRADITION" but that MUSIC was brought into the garden of Eden as wind, string and percussion instruments. Lucifer was the holy whore who WHOLLY SEDUCED Eve and then Adam. As ZOE she claims to be the MOTHER OF THE GODS who is always a HOLY WHORE who demands the musical worship of "little dumb jehovah" and her son/ brother, the Logos or Jesus. Music, theatrical rhetorics, and homosexuality are MOTHER and her FRUITS, perverted sexuality STANDING IN THE HOLY PLACE claiming to be gods.

A Christian Church writer notes that modern worship is EFFEMINATE and EFFEMINIZING. That charge is that the CHURCH is in part to blame for the EXPLOSION of immaturity and homosexuality.

If you jump off a tall building you BREAK GOD'S LAW and you go smash. If you break God's Laws and Written Word the RESULT is homosexuality. As we noted, reject the Word, God pours out His wrath and this means to MAKE YOU INTO A BUFFOON or PARASITE.

Speaking of the musical idolaters at Mount Sinai, God GAVE THEM UP because they rejected the WORD OF GRACE. Then God gave them a LAW OF WORKS and further expounders have to do a lot of LEGALISTIC WORK to make the Word of God "available" to you--for a price just like the Sophists or hypocrites.

Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Rom 1: 24

Rubel Shelly and John York: Rubel: Thus homosexuality is wrong not because it violates a command but because it violates the divine will as expressed in creation itself.

It is the unholy violation of the created order that generates the biblical prohibitions.

God's will becomes a law:

There is a law of CAUSE AND EFFECT in jumping off buildings. But we don't know that until we hit the ground. Would it be LEGALISTIC for God to write a commandment "Thou shalt not jump"? There is a cause and effect in the TOTALITY of history about women who take the lead in worship. It has always led, in fact, to homosexuality in worship. The "goddesses" accepted only emascualted or even sex-changed priests. Even self emasculation made a PRIEST availabie to SERVE in the temples to collect money from men. In church history it is the disenfranchised preachers who lost their STATE salaries and his camp followers who always led into musical or charismatic or sexual religion. It was a parasite to others who were all alone.

The NEW WINESKIN gives the children permission to drink wine: the USE of practicing homosexual in the ministry would give THEM PERMISSION to be homosexuals. Since the Bible says that it is an abomination then why question whether Paul was a homophobic?

Others believe that NATURE means that GOD DID NOT CREATE THEM THAT WAY. Therefore, they have done something and the RESULT is sodomy:

Irenaeus used the word "Sodomites" and did not make them into a religious order:

And again Jeremiah says,

"They are become like horses, furious about females; each one neighed after his neighbour's wife." And Isaiah, when preaching in Judea, and reasoning with Israel, termed them "rulers of Sodom" and "people of Gomorrah;"
........... intimating that they were like the Sodomites in wickedness,
........... and that the same description of sins was rife among them,
........... calling them by the same name, because of the similarity of their conduct.

And inasmuch as they were not by nature so created by God, but had power also to act rightly, the same person said to them, giving them good counsel,

"Wash ye, make you clean; take away iniquity from your souls before mine eyes; cease from your iniquities."

Thus, no doubt, since they had transgressed and sinned in the same manner,
........... so did they receive the same reproof as did the Sodomites.

But when they should be converted and come to repentance, and cease from evil, they should have power to become the sons of God, and to receive the inheritance of immortality which is given by Him.

For this reason, therefore, He has termed those "angels of the devil," and "children of the wicked one," who give heed to the devil, and do his works. But these are, at the same time, all created by the one and the same God.

When, however, they believe and are subject to God, and go on and keep His doctrine, they are the sons of God; but when they have apostatized and fallen into transgression, they are ascribed to their chief, the devil-to him who first became the cause of apostasy to himself, and afterwards to others.

I believe that every had TRUTH as the expression of God's will. The law was always against the worship of CREATURES (man or beast). In Exodus the worship of creatures was NATURAL but against the will of God. If this is not true then how could they change TRUTH into A LIE. Was there not law against worshiping the creture?

Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. Rom 1: 25

For this cause God gave them up unto vile (disgraceful) affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: Rom 1: 26

And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. Rom 1: 27

Aschemosune (g808) as-kay-mos-oo'-nay; from 809; an indecency: by impl. the pudenda: - shame, that which is unseemly.

Behold, I come like a thief! Blessed is he who stays awake and keeps his clothes with him, so that he may not go naked and be shamefully exposed." Re.16:15

Nakedness between man and man was PROHIBITED by Law. The steps on the NATIONAL temple were carved and therefore the PRIESTS could expose their NAKEDNESS. This was AGAINST the Law.

This NAKEDNESS is connected directly to the GYMNASIUM build in Jerusalem. Because it was for physical training, they went naked. Therefore, homosexuality and the GYMNASIUM were huge problems.

The CAUSE was not just anti-nature which no society seemed to have grasped without revelation. But homosexuality was caused by those who removed GOD'S TRUTH from their children. Homosexuality, if Paul wasn't a liar, is the NATURAL deconnecting from God. We can see it in the last few decades where the Word has been relegated to "seven facts about Jesus."

And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Rom 1: 28

Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Rom 1: 29

Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Rom 1: 30

Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Rom 1: 31

These PRODUCTS of rejecting the Word included fornication, haters of God, proud, boasters and murderers. Therefore, Paul would prohibit murders from ministry. But Paul speaks specificially of PRESIDING OVER or USURPING leadership. This wold be like refusing to have the Word in their heads and God would send the same punishment expressed in wrong actions.

Who, knowing the judgment of God,
........... that they which commit such things are worthy of death,
........... not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. Rom 1:32

EVERYONE disagrees with Shelly and York and everyone agrees with PAUL.

See The Sons of God.

See Alexander Hislop The Great Red Dragon

Clement: Recognitions, the Post Flood Beginning of musical idolatry

Chapter XIII.- Origin of Idolatry.

"But when all these things were done, men turned again to impiety; [There is a similar chapter in Homily IX. 7, but in a discourse: on the following day.-R.] and on this account a law was given by God to instruct them in the manner of living.

But in process of time, the worship of God and righteousness were corrupted by the unbelieving and the wicked, as we shall show more fully by and by.

Moreover, perverse and erratic religions were introduced, to which the greater part of men gave themselves up,

by occasion of holidays and solemnities, instituting drinkings and banquets,

following pipes, and flutes, and harps, and diverse kinds of musical instruments, and indulging themselves in all kinds of drunkenness and luxury.

Hence every kind of error took rise; hence they invented groves and altars, fillets and victims, and after drunkenness they were agitated as if with mad emotions.

By this means power was given to the demons to enter into minds of this sort, so that they seemed to lead insane dances and to rave like Bacchanalians; hence were invented the gnashing of teeth, and bellowing from the depth of their bowels; hence a terrible countenance and a fierce aspect in men,

so that he whom drunkenness had subverted and a demon had instigated, was believed by the deceived and the erring to be filled with the Deity.

It is specificially charismatic or exhilarating worship which replaces THE SCHOOL OF THE BIBLE which strokes every nerve ending and leads to an outbreak of sexuality. History confirms it.

Chapter VII.-Sacrificial Orgies.

"But they did not cease to worship images, by reason of the evil intelligence of the magicians, who found excuses for them, which had power to constrain them to the foolish worship For, establishing this things by magical ceremonies, they assigned them feasts from sacrifices, libations, flutes, and shoutings,

by means ofj which senseless men, being deceived, and their kingdom being taken from them, yet did not desist from the worship that they had taken up with.

To such an extent did they prefer error, on account of its pleasantness, before truth.

They also howl after their sacrificial surfeit, their soul from the depth, as it were by dreams, forewarning them of the punishment that is to befall such deeds of theirs.

Rubel Shelly and John York: Rubel: Homosexuality is unlike racism, slavery, or female roles in the life of the church for the simple reason that only one of these issues is rooted in creation itself.

All the others have to do with the use and abuse of power in the human community. Even so, we must be careful against being understood to endorse for a moment the hateful attitudes that some believers exhibit toward homosexuals.

To the contrary, this is one of those opportunities in our culture for the church to be the incarnation of love to persons whose behavior we cannot sanction.

Well, the Bible and sexual literature claim that homosexuality is a PRODUCT of pagan rituals including MUSIC to gain MIND CONTROL to fill the collection plates. H. LaGard Smith said that "if women quit speaking in tongues then speaking in tongues would cease." If women quit pushing for music and excitement then music would cease. Karen Armstrong, in A History of God claims that the WORD is masculine while religious rituals is feminine. If women or effeminate leaders quit leading then men would be happy to go to "Bible classes."

Paul puts homosexuality at the head of a list which includes:

unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

Paul puts them all as rooted in God abandoning those who refuse to honor the Word of God. This includes more than homosexuality. In fact, all sin is rooted in IGNORING the Word. Too accuse Paul of being Culturally deprived is to IGNORE THE WORD and what we see in the modern church is God's pouring out His wrath through strong deluders.

There can be no doubt that the rise of charismatic and Satanic music leads people into homosexuality and drugs. MUSIC even in church creates a DRUG HIGH. The clapping, hand waving and swaying is the result of sexual stimulation. Many people get INITIATED at Rock concerts just as the Jewish priests honoring Dionysus wanted to initiate Jesus into the perverted song and dance while they PIPED.

The universal testimony is that demon driven RELIGIOUS RITUALS leads into drunkeness and homosexuality. That is why professionals are HIRED to attract people to "worship." But, that is why Jesus died to remove the CLERGY off our backs. They laded burdens which are defined as "spiritual anxiety created by religious rituals."

The NEW STYLE WORSHIP is exactly what caused the Flood survivors to almost immediately become the builders of Towers of Babylon.

Racists believed that God COMMANDED them to make slaves of the South Africans. You know, slavery and racisism, contra Shelly, was not a produce of the "non-instrumental" churches of Christ.

That is untrue: we have shown that HOMOSEXUALITY is rooted in charismatic worship which appeared when Israel ROSE UP TO PLAY. This was musical idolatry and the NATURAL OUTCOME was sexuality and homosexuality.

Rubel Shelly and John York are setting up their PAYMASTERS from the unlawful LAW OF GIVING to accept the role of women in NON-SEDENTARY roles by trying to prove that HOMOSEXUALITY is based on NATURE while the role of women is based on CULTURE taught by a CULTURALLY CRIPPLED Paul.

God through the word says that HOMOSEXUALITY arises among those who HATE THE WORD. In some sense, it is the punishment of God in that it is the PREDESTINATED outcome of the NEW STYLE RELIGION which puts its focus on attractive RESPECT OF PERSONS with a musical talent. These were always SOUGHT OUT by the priests.

Rubel Shelly and John York: Rubel: The challenge to conservative churches

is less to join our voices in confessing that we regard Scripture as God-breathed communication

than to eat with, pray with, and otherwise encourage persons who feel homosexual or lesbian desires. Where do such feelings originate?

Are there genetic factors that predispose certain people to these yearnings?

Is this a rhetorical question like the one about Paul being homophobic? Paul would say that if they have predespositions reason God TURNS THEM LOOSE is that they begin to despise His Word. No doubt music gives permission for many to act out their feelings: the result is still DISGUSTING and worthy of death because Paul groups it with murder.

But THEIR notion of God breathed is ripped apart by the CORE GOSPEL. This claims that all but seven FACTS about Jesus have been filtered through philosophy and the writers OWN PERSONAL AGANDA. That means that the God breathed SCRIPTURE is now available only through rhetoricians, sOPHISts, singers and musicians as SORCERERS or PARASITES who are INCARNATED by having the THIRD MEMBER OF the Family of Gods speaking to them in AUDIBLE VOICES. This is why the Shelly - York TAKING LIBERTIES with Paul allows them to DISREGARD Paul and writer their OWN NARRATIVE which is the latest fad out of the Manufacturning Plants of rhetoricians, sOPHISts, singers and musicians claimed by ACU to be the PROPHETEC CHANELLERS or FACILITATORS of the new changes.

We are not aware that the natural repudiation of homosexuality is a PRODUCT of conservative churches any more than the claim that RACISM seems to have originated with "conservative" or "non-instrumental" churches (that RACA term). Rubel Shelly claims that instrumental "worshipers" see CONSERVATIVES somewhat like racists, fire bomber of clinics and dangerous to women wearing fur.

THAT IS THE PLANNED PROGRAM TO LEAD YOU AWAY FROM CHRIST AND HIS WORD AND TOWARD THE "IDOLATRY OF PERSONALITY."

Clement wrote

Such images of divine wisdom are many; but I shall mention one instance, and expound it in a few words. The fate of the Sodomites was
........... judgment to those who had done wrong,
........... instruction to those who hear.

The Sodomites having, through much luxury, fallen into uncleanness, practising adultery shamelessly, and burning with insane love for boys; the All-seeing Word, whose notice those who commit impieties cannot escape, cast His eye on them. Nor did the sleepless guard of humanity observe their licentiousness in silence; but dissuading us from the imitation of them, and training us up to His own temperance, and falling on some sinners,

lest lust being unavenged, should break loose from all the restraints of fear, ordered Sodom to be burned, pouting forth a little of the sagacious fire on licentiousness; lest lust, through want of punishment,

should throw wide the gates to those that were rushing into voluptuousness. Accordingly, the just punishment of the Sodomites became to men an image of the salvation which is well calculated for men.

In our review of Nadab and Abihu we saw that FIRE BROKE OUT and showed that Paul warned those who DON NOT approach God in REVERENCE and GODLY FEAR. Why is it evil to attempt to create EXHILARATION or ENTHUSIASM (Philo's Enthus O mania or madness) and call it SPIRITUAL WORSHIP? This violates he direct command of Paul in Romans 15 and the "singing" passages. Paul said that it is because GOD IS A CONSUMING FIRE. Rom 12.

For those who have not committed like sins with those who are punished, will never receive a like punishment. By guarding against sinning, we guard against suffering. "For I would have you know," says Jude,

"that God, having once saved His people from the land of Egypt, afterwards destroyed them that believed not; and the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, He hath reserved to the judgment of the great day, in everlasting chains under darkness of the savage angels."

And a little after he sets forth, in a most instructive manner, representations of those that are judged: "Woe unto them, for they have gone in the way of Cain, and run greedily after the error of Balaam, and perished in the gainsaying of Core."

For those, who cannot attain the privilege of adoption, fear keeps from growing insolent. For punishments and threats are for this end, that fearing the penalty we may abstain from sinning. I might relate to you punishments for ostentation, and punishments for vainglory, not only for licentiousness; and adduce the censures pronounced on those whose hearts are bad through wealth, in which censures the Word through fear restrains from evil acts. But sparing prolixity in my treatise, I shall bring forward the following precepts of the Instructor, that you may guard against His threatenings.

Congenital liars seem to INHERIT that propensity from their ancestors whom they never knew. However, one becomes a LIAR when some authority figure GIVES THEM PERMISSION to be a liar by saying that "Oh, that is a situational situation." It ALL depends on what your CULTURE accepts. People become liars because they find that they can get away with it. One might repent of lying but the lying nature may just be dormant.

Where does MURDER, incest, child mollestation, infidelity with hundreds of homosexual practice come from? Where does pornography come from? Do we want a NON-PRACTICING addict to be in the PULPIT? What about bank robbers? Where does a bank robber come from? We act as if these people did not begin their lives as child mollesters. When did they begin? The concensus is that when they abandoned truth and PARTICIPATED in wrong practices their brain was FORMED to prefer evil.

Paul insisted that a shepherd be WITHOUT HANDLES. That is, an elder must not have problems in his life which people can grasp and reduce his LIFE which we are to follow as obedience. Why should a dormant homosexual STAND IN THE HOLY PLACE when there are many fine men who do not have such a handicap to overcome. The church is not a Works Projects Administration to employ troubled men just because the have rhetorical or sophistical skills.

It has been noted that musicians and singers both ATTRACT and REPULSE us. This is the persona of all PERFORMING ARTS including performance preaching. However, as homosexuals claim to control movies, music and TV, their next goal is to CONTROL RELIGION. Therefore, to FACILITATE "making a place in the mainstream" we have seen singers and musicians added with the claim that they can "lead you into the presence of God." However, the "persona" of musicians is like that of the dress designer. Without rejecting them as persons just WHY do we want musicians and "spiritual" homosexuals in the pulpit.

Those who reject scripture know that they are disgusting many and deliberately SOWING DISCORD to MAKE A PLACE IN THE MAINSTREAM for those who are the PATTERNISM of pagan, Word rejectors from the beginning until today. Worrisome. Why is it that we have had to await the POST MODERN 13th apostles to get this revelation which SEEMS to be doing, as Rubel Shelly advises, "become as much like the world as possible to win the world." Who wants them.

By making homosexuality just a violation of NATURE and not God's commands, the effort is to say that the old views about WOMEN IN MINISTRY was just a product of the same "possibly homophobic" Paul''s hatred of women. This is the Hegelian dialectic: you set up tension between homosexuality (as against nature) while the role of women is the product o f PAUL'S commands which are the product of perverted culture.

We breath a sigh of relief that we are NOT NOW going to add a homosexual minister and feel so relieved that we are JUST going to GIVE (by our graciousness) a role for women which all of the Bible, Paul's direct commands and history.

Surely, we might accept a female elder or preacher if the OPTION or other choice is to have serving homosexuals.

The conclusions are wrong: God issued direct commands against homosexuality and we can point to the chapter and verse. We also see the Bible and culture saying that HOMOSEXUALITY is a product of the culture primarily religious rituals where people had their faces rubbed in homosexual performing practices and the addition of music which according to the Bible was brought by Lucifer, the harp-playing, bi-sexual ENEMY of Christ. Many people are crying out that our RELIGION and especially its performance preaching and music is an EFFEMINATE display and causes the EFFEMINIZING of the church. Click to read a Christian Church Minister (deceased).

 

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